Two vying for circuit court judge position cite life experiences along with legal backgrounds

Neither Amit Kapoor nor Katina Saint Marie claim to have followed a straightforward path to their careers in law.

Each has an advanced degree in a subject other than law. They also both cite experiences far from the courtroom as helpful in ensuring fairness and empathy for people appearing in Lane County Circuit Court.

“I think a lot of people think that judges are these sort of aloof, powerful people,” Kapoor said.

Not so, Kapoor said.

“We care. We’re listening,” he said.

In the May 19 election, voters will choose between Kapoor, a judge since a 2020 governor’s appointment who previously worked as a public defender, and Saint Marie, a family law practitioner in Eugene and a pro-tem circuit court judge.

Voters elect circuit court judges to six-year terms in nonpartisan races. Circuit court judges preside over civil and criminal cases and often have assignments to other specialty courts, such as drug court. They are paid $204,060 a year. 

Kapoor and Saint Marie are vying for Position 6 in Oregon’s 2nd Judicial District. Six other Lane County Circuit Court judges — Bradley A. Cascagnette, Charles M. Zennaché, Kamala H. Shugar, Clara L. Rigmaiden, Jessica E. May and Allison Knight — are running unopposed.

Katina Saint Marie 

While working as a secretary at a law office, Saint Marie, 53, told her boss she would one day be a lawyer.

“He kind of laughed about that,” Saint Marie said.

Now, with almost 20 years of experience as a practicing attorney, Saint Marie said she’s mindful about the importance of people being able to seek out their own opportunities.

“No matter what, I never want to be one of those people that doesn’t want someone else to get where I maybe am at,” Saint Marie said.

She said she wants to hear from people appearing in court to better understand their experiences. The court system should “meet people where they are at,” Saint Marie said.

“I get reminders on my phone about every single other appointment that I have, but I don’t think people are getting phone reminders about their court dates,” Saint Marie said. For the courts, she said it’s important to ask, “How can we improve our systems to make it more user-friendly?” 

She said she’s passionate about access to justice. Her family law clients “want a better life for themselves, a better life for their kids,” she said. 

“I just relate to my clients, because it’s hard to make your way through the world. And I know that,” Saint Marie said.

Born in Denver, Saint Marie also lived in Kansas before coming to Oregon from Las Vegas at 17 with her partner, whom she later married and had two children with.

The colleges they applied to guided their choice of where to live, she said.

“And I picked here, because I wanted to be in a rainy place,” Saint Marie said.

But she said she couldn’t afford to attend the University of Oregon, where her partner attended law school. The couple’s two children are now grown, and the marriage ended in divorce in 2000, she said. She is currently married.

“I started at LCC in winter of 1991, and it took me 13 years to get my associate transfer degree because I was working and supporting my kids,” Saint Marie said, adding that she worked multiple job at times. There were “lots of times that my former husband didn’t earn any money as a lawyer,” she said.

Saint Marie said there “was violence in my home,” describing her decision to leave the marriage.

In 2001, she began applying for jobs at UO to get discounted tuition, landing a university job in 2002.

“My employment and schooling were always really linked for me,” Saint Marie said, describing working more than a half-time position but not quite full-time while a student.

She was a single parent during her undergraduate years. 

“Nobody in my family went to college. Nobody understood this world. There was nobody walking that path in front of me that I could rely on,” Saint Marie said.

‘People are in this journey together’

Law school was always her goal, but in addition to a law degree awarded in 2007, she pursued a doctorate in English literature “because I loved it,” completing her doctorate in 2015.

“I was focused on 16th century English literature, which very much has the world view that I appreciate, of, people are in this journey together, and we’re here to support each other,” Saint Marie said.

She practiced law while completing the requirements of her doctoral degree, and said her background helps her connect with her family law clients.

“Because those experiences are just so with me still, I meet clients who are extremely vulnerable in society who have a lot of strikes against them, big uphill battles,” Saint Marie said. “And when they become vulnerable enough to tell me about their goals and aspirations, I just say, ‘Go for it.’”

She said she applied in 2020 and 2022 to be appointed as a judge, making it to the finalist stage in 2022. She applied again last fall, and wasn’t granted an interview.

“It started really seeming like if you don’t have connections in the governor’s office, you’re not going to get it,” Saint Marie said.

After getting some encouragement to run for the position, Saint Marie said, “I just thought, If I don’t go for this, I’m going to regret it.”

In addition to her family law experience, she’s served as a pro-tem judge, meaning she’s been called on to fill in during certain proceedings in Lane County Circuit Court.

Her campaign counts among endorsements Marty Wilde, a former Oregon state representative, and Doug Mitchell, a retired Lane County Circuit Court judge.

“I’m not here to critique my opponent, and so I’m not going to comment on his judging,” Saint Marie said.

But when asked about Kapoor’s lengthier list of endorsers, which include Eugene’s mayor and several current or former elected officials, Saint Marie didn’t hesitate to paint herself as someone outside of politics.

“I don’t have political connections. I don’t know people in power, and this is a nonpartisan race. When I look at the endorsers [for Kapoor], I wonder about that,” Saint Marie said.

“I think voters should look at our record. They should look at who I am, they should look at who my opponent is, and they should make a decision based on who is best-suited to serve the people in this community. What have we done? What are we doing? What do we bring to the table?” Saint Marie said. “Not, who do we know?”

Amit Kapoor 

Kapoor, 49, came to the United States as an eighth-grader after living his early childhood life in India. His childhood was spent in North India, outside of Delhi. Growing up, English was a third language, after Hindi and Punjabi, he said.

“We had a pretty frugal life,” Kapoor said. Though his mother worked as a nurse and his father as a doctor, they worked in a “public sector” hospital and the family lived in a subsidized apartment, he said.

He called himself fortunate in “comparison to the deep, deep poverty that is present in India,” which he saw in his neighborhood growing up.

His background gives him “a sense of disempowerment,” he said, comparing an immigrant’s concern about speaking English with an accent to what people experience in court.

For many in court, “you’re going to a place you’re not that familiar with,” Kapoor said. “People are speaking a version of a language that you’re not deeply fluent with, and other people around you seem to have a better idea of what’s really going on and what’s expected.”

He wasn’t always looking to become a practicing lawyer. Kapoor attended the University of Iowa in his home state in the United States. He became interested in sociology.

“I have been fascinated for a long time with how people organize their lives; how does our identity form?” Kapoor said.

He enrolled in a graduate program to earn an advanced sociology degree and a law degree. At the time, he was interested in teaching.

“Having a law degree, I think I felt that would make me a better teacher and a better researcher,” said Kapoor, who ultimately earned a master’s degree in sociology.

Kapoor taught at the University of Montana, teaching “issues of gender, race, inequality, stratification,” he said.

But once he settled on practicing law, he said he didn’t hesitate in choosing a role as a public defender, as he had an interest in public service and “issues of community.”

It was a job where he said he put in the work and others took notice, encouraging him to seek a judicial appointment.

“I had over 1,200 clients as a public defender,” Kapoor said. “I was in court nearly every day, sometimes multiple times a day, working with very vulnerable people,” Kapoor said.

As a judge, he spoke of his efforts to build trust in the system. It’s important to read reports from social welfare agencies before court hearings in dependency court, for example, he said.

“I want those parents to feel a trust in the system, that the courts are not here to snatch their babies or to remove their children. The courts are here to figure out, hey, what’s the thing that’s causing the harm potentially to the child,” Kapoor said.

He offers time breaks to people in the “high emotion place” that a courtroom can be so they can gather themselves and ultimately “express their feeling,” he said.

“I try to think of, how can I best be of service to this person, these facts, and the law that applies in these circumstances,” Kapoor said, calling that a skill built through experience.

“I’ve been doing the job, doing it well, and have experience with thousands and thousands of hearings,” he said.

His campaign cites endorsements from not only attorneys, but also former Gov. Kate Brown, State Sen. James Manning, State Sen. Floyd Prozanski, Eugene Mayor Kaarin Knudson and two former mayors, Lucy Vinis and Kitty Piercey.

‘A heartfelt conversation hundreds of times’

As a defense attorney, Kapoor said he believes “many people saw me in court attending to my clients as an aware and compassionate person.”

In one-on-one talks with some clients who had drug issues, he said he’d discuss their “clean date,” the last time they had used a prohibited or addictive substance.

For Kapoor, it would be a chance to do some math and count up all the moments since that date, always presenting them with a large number.

He’d then describe stressful situations – be it a car breaking down, an overdue bill or a hot water heater going out – and tell them, “In that moment, you may be triggered, and I want you to look back and tell yourself, you’re the person that made the right decision for yourself 400,000 times,” referring back to his previous “clean date” calculations done in front of the client.

In those many moments, “that’s who you are,” Kapoor said he’d tell them. “That’s who you are.”

As a judge, he said he cannot emote with clients and must stay neutral, but he’s delivered similar messages from the bench.

“Our community, like many communities, is dealing with an intersection of a lot of problems,” Kapoor said, listing homelessness, addiction and mental health as three top concerns.

“There’s hardly a case I can think of that I have presided over that involves substance abuse where I did not take the time to connect with a person, both to congratulate them on a good job – you know, ‘12 million moments you’ve made the right decision for yourself’ – or to hold them accountable,” Kapoor said.

As a judge, “I’ve engaged in a heartfelt conversation hundreds of times when that is the issue,” he said, adding, “I think I don’t know how to be a different judge.”